 
 
 
 
Roxanne Anderson Narrator   Andrea Jenkins Interviewer 
 
 
 
 
 
The Transgender Oral History Project Tretter Collection in GLBT Studies University of Minnesota 
July 23, 2015 
 
 
 
 
  

  
 
The Transgender Oral History Project of the Upper Midwest will empower individuals to tell their story, while providing students, historians, and the public with a more rich foundation of primary source material about the transgender community.  The project is part of the Tretter Collection at the University of Minnesota.  The archive provides a record of GLBT thought, knowledge and culture for current and future generations and is available to students, researchers and members of the public. 
The Transgender Oral History Project will collect up to 400 hours of oral histories involving 200 to 300 individuals over the next three years.  Major efforts will be the recruitment of individuals of all ages and experiences, and documenting the work of The Program in Human Sexuality.  This project will be led by Andrea Jenkins, poet, writer, and trans-activist.  Andrea brings years of experience working in government, non-profits and LGBT organizations.  If you are interested in being involved in this exciting project, please contact Andrea. 
Andrea Jenkins jenki120@umn.edu (612) 625-4379 
 
 
 
 
  
Andrea Jenkins  -AJ 1 
Roxanne Anderson -RA 2 
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AJ:  So my name is Andrea Jenkins and this is The Transgender Oral History Project at the University 5 of Minnesota Tretter Collection.  Today is July 23, 2015, and I am here with Roxanne Anderson. 6 
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RA: Yes. 8 
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AJ: Can you please state your name, your preferred gender pronouns, your gender identity, and 10 your gender assigned at birth? 11 
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RA: My name is Roxanne Anderson, my preferred pronouns are they and them, and the gender that 13 I was assigned at birth is female and I identify as masculine of center, gender nonconforming.   14 
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AJ: So, Roxanne, can you tell me what is one of your earliest memories? 16 
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RA: I think one of my earliest memories is sitting in the rocking chair, my mom reading me a story.  18 Thats one of my very first memories.   19 
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AJ: Do you remember what the story was at all?   21 
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RA: Yeah, it was a story about this young little girl who liked to swing and there was some poetry in 23 that story and some flow to how it went.  I kind of still remember some of the lines of that poem 24 and I think the poetry, I got locked in then.   25 
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AJ: Wow, yeah  I know you write some amazing poetry, well talk about that in a little while.  27 Where did you go to elementary school? 28 
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RA: I went to elementary school in Anderson, Indiana, at the James Whitcomb Riley Elementary 30 School. 31 
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AJ: Can you repeat that? 33 
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RA: Yeah, its James Whitcomb Riley Elementary School in Anderson, Indiana.   35 
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AJ: Im going to need to spell or learn how to spell Whitcomb.   37 
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RA: Whitcomb. 39 
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AJ: So that we can make sure that we get it right in the transcripts.  So you grew up in Indiana, what 41 was your home environment like? 42 
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RA: My home environment was mom and dad and my brother.  My brother and I are adopted.  And 44 then when I was probably in the 6th grade, I think, we adopted two more children into our 45 family. 46 
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AJ: Oh, wow.   2 
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RA: So we had a trans-racial family where the children were trans-racially adopted into white 4 homes.  Mixed kids into white homes.   5 
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AJ: OK.  So I know you identify as sort of masculine of center. 7 
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RA: Sure do. 9 
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AJ: When did you first recognize that your gender was something other than the gender you were 11 assigned at birth?   12 
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RA: Wow.  I would say that I probably didnt really have the words until I was in my late 20s, but I 14 definitely had the recognition that I didnt like the same things that other girls my age liked and 15 that when we played together I was often the male role.  I was always the daddy or the brother 16 or the uncle whenever we played house or those kinds of things. 17 
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AJ: And what age was that? 19 
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RA: Oh, little  like four, five, six, seven.  One of my best friends and I had the same doll and I took . . 21 . the doll, it was called Chrissy, and she had hair that kind of grew and I pulled the hair out of my 22 Chrissy doll and Chrissy became Christopher very quickly.   23 
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AJ: I noticed in our introduction you talked about a queer identity, I think.   25 
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RA: Yes. 27 
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AJ: And thats not necessarily a common term in our . . . so maybe I should say it hasnt been used 29 positively always, there was a negative connotation to the term queer for many, many, many 30 years.  So Im wondering when you began using that term to describe yourself and what does it 31 mean for you? 32 
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RA: I think I began using the word queer probably when I worked at District 202.  District 202 is a 34 youth center and so a lot of the young people were using that terminology as a stance of 35 empowerment.  I liked it and it resonated with me.  I think when I first came out, I identified as a 36 lesbian and that never really felt right for me and it always felt weird in my mouth and I never 37 really liked calling myself a lesbian.  And so, when I first heard the word queer I was like, Oh, I 38 like that way better.  Also because lesbian has such a female line to it and that masculine part 39 of me, it never just resonated well with it.   40 
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AJ: Wow, yeah  thats really important.  So, District 202.  I know that you were the program 42 manager, I believe. 43 
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RA: I was.  I was the program director for five years. 45 
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AJ: Program director  right.  For five years  and District 202 is no longer a part of our landscape 1 here in Minneapolis and in the Twin Cities.  How important do you think District 202 was? 2 
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RA: I think District 202 was very important and while there might not be a physical structure 4 anymore, its definitely not part of our landscape, I think for the folks that engaged at District 5 202, whether that was board members or volunteers or the young people that went there, 6 District 202 is a part of our soul. 7 
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AJ: Absolutely  no, I agree.  I run into Michael Kaplan from time to time, who was the founder of 9 District 202, and it amazes me that some of the young people that I met when I was a board 10 member at District 202 are doing some amazing things in our community . . .  11 
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RA: Yes, thats true. 13 
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AJ:  . . . right now, and Im just so proud of them.  Can you identify any of those young people that 15 were a part and now . . .? 16 
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RA: I think that Anna Min is a perfect example of one of those young folks that kind of came out of 18 202 during the era that I was there.  Anna is an amazing community member, activist, and 19 organizer and does her own right to capture the history of our community.   20 
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AJ: Absolutely, Anna is a photographer. 22 
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RA: Yes, she is a brilliant photographer and a DJ.   24 
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AJ: Wow, I didnt know that  so Im learning some things here.  What do you think was the 26 downfall of District 202? 27 
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RA: Oh, since this is recorded Ill be careful.   29 
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AJ: I really want the real story. 31 
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RA: OK, Ill try to give the real story without incriminating anybody.  I think that the downfall of 33 District 202 was really adultism.  I think that it was really about adults trying to control young 34 people and use their power over them instead of incorporating the ideas that young people had.  35 We say all the time things like, Children are the future, and theyre supposed to help lead us 36 but as adults we often have a hard time letting that happen.  I think theres real knowledge, 37 power, and strength in youth.  I think that adults really kind of let their ego get in the way.  And I 38 also think that there is this thing that was kind of happening with technology in our country and 39 in Minneapolis where folks were plugging into the internet and to social media in a really 40 different way than we ever had before and I think that that kind of shininess of a new thing was 41 distracting to the physical space and I think adults thought that young people were hanging out 42 online all the time anyway and thats what they wanted.   43 
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AJ: OK.  I dont want to be leading the questions really, but I was a board member at District 202 as 1 well.  There was a time, particularly when you came, that the young people who showed up at 2 District 202 began to look different.   3 
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RA: Yes. 5 
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AJ: There were white kids who had their parents bringing them from the suburbs and really 7 engaged and volunteering at the center and being a part of what was happening there, and then 8 there was this sort of shift where lots of young people of color and lots of trans-identified 9 people and homeless kids started to come to District 202.  Do you think that had anything to do 10 with sort of the shift in the priority?  Because I remember a time when District 202 was the 11 absolute darling of the LGBT community. 12 
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RA: Sure, sure.  I think that District 202 kind of remained that way until I left.  What I mean by that is 14 the darling of the community.  One of the very last events that I was a part of literally had young 15 people wrapped around the block to come into the building.  I think that really what happened 16 when I left was this shift kind of back to where District 202 was before I got there, which was a 17 lot of suburban white youth started coming in which made the youth of color feel displaced and 18 I think that that kind of added to the angst that adults were feeling about what are we going to 19 do.  Its easier to kind of take care of people that have access and supportive situations than 20 people who dont and a lot of the young people that were at District 202 were young people 21 who were finding ways to actually support each other.  I think that went a little bit against kind 22 of this youth savior model that lots of agencies have and thats, Here are these youth who have 23 disparaging things, and lets help them.  And I think the young people at District 202 were at 24 the point where they were saying, We dont want you to help us, we want you to provide a 25 container for us to help ourselves.  And I think that that was really hard for adults to 26 understand because were the state known for advocacy and helping other people and so I think 27 that people really didnt know kind of how to take this leadership stance and really build on the 28 empowerment that young people were finding. 29 
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AJ: Yeah.  I really miss District 202.   31 
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RA: I do too.   33 
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AJ: So, can you talk about some of the challenges that youve faced since you have begun to express 35 your true gender identity? 36 
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RA: Yeah.  I think that one of the very first challenges was around people kind of understanding 38 pronoun usage and one of those big challenges was with my mom.  My mom had English as a 39 minor and she couldnt kind of wrap her head around the idea and the concept of they and 40 them until I kind of gave her some exercises and those exercises were about writing  Id just ask 41 her to write 10 sentences using they and them instead of he or she.  When she completed that, 42 she was like, Oh, OK  that actually works.  But initially she was of the mindset that that is not 43 proper grammar and so it was really hard.  I think the grammar thing is often hard for people to 44 get and then theres always the challenge of bathroom usage and which bathroom is safe and 45 which bathroom do I choose. 46 
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AJ: Wow, say more about that.   2 
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RA: I think for folks who are transitioning, kind of to either spectrum, the bathroom issue is still 4 relevant and its present and every time they go to the bathroom its there.  I think for gender 5 nonconforming folks there is kind of this split about the bathroom.  So we have the same angst, 6 we have the same anxiety, and then when it gets down to it, sometimes its a matter of . . . its a 7 different matter of choice.  And so, trans females that I know, for example, arent going to 8 hesitate about going . . . they might hesitate about going into the female bathroom, but thats 9 the bathroom that theyre going to choose, right? 10 
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AJ: Right.   12 
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RA: And I think for gender nonconforming folks, there is still that hesitation and then there is still the 14 choice after that hesitation.  So I think sometimes I struggle with that a little bit.   15 
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AJ: How do you work through that?  17 
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RA: I trust my gut.  Its really a matter of what my gut is telling me at the moment. 19 
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AJ: Have you ever had any negative experiences in the bathroom? 21 
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RA: Sure, just about every time I choose to go to the female bathroom because of my voice and if 23 people dont see me kind of head on or from the side so they can kind of see my breasts 24 outlined, then they have this moment of hesitation and theres often a look at the door to make 25 sure theyre in the right place, or a look at me like, Youre in the wrong place.  And so I think 26 that thats kind of the hard part.  Ive never experienced a challenge in the mens room.   27 
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AJ: Hmm, that is fascinating.   29 
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RA: Its always in the womens bathroom.   31 
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AJ: And has there ever been any sort of legal interaction with bathrooms? 33 
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RA: No, never legal.  I just went on a road trip to Florida and so I chose to use the mens bathroom 35 only because the womens bathroom was really occupied.  If Im someplace where I dont know, 36 I generally tend to choose the bathroom of the gender that I was assigned because I dont know 37 the legality.  And so, I dont remember where I was  maybe Kentucky or Tennessee, 38 somewhere in the belt of the Bible Belt, and I chose to go in the mens bathroom because the 39 womens bathroom was being occupied in a very large way by a family who . . . they were 40 changing diapers and all that kind of stuff.  And so I went into the mens bathroom and as I was 41 coming out, the employees of the gas stop were standing there kind of waiting for me.  And, we 42 didnt really exchange anything, they were just kind of there and I think probably what 43 happened is another customer said, Theres somebody in the boys bathroom who shouldnt be 44 in there.  45 
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AJ: Oh wow. 1 
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RA: So I dont know if they were coming for safety or if they were coming for policing. 3 
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AJ: But they didnt . . .? 5 
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RA: But they didnt have actual . . .  7 
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AJ: They didnt accost you or anything like that.   9 
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RA: No. 11 
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AJ: Great.  So speaking of family, whats your current relationship with your birth family? 13 
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RA: My current relationship with my birth family is null and void because I dont have a connection 15 to my birth family.  My adopted family is really good.  I just spent a lot of time with them in the 16 last couple of weeks.  I call my mom a couple times a week and she calls me.   17 
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AJ: Boy, my mom would love you.   19 
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RA: And its not always just because I want to chat, its usually because Im reporting on some other 21 member of my family.  My maternal grandmother is still alive, shes 98 and so I talk to her pretty 22 frequently . . . or actually I talk to my mom who interprets because she cant really hear on the 23 phone anymore.  But yeah, we do that.  And then I have a pretty good connection with my 24 brothers, they both live in Minneapolis.   25 
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AJ: Thats awesome.  As I know youre aware, lots of trans people are really disconnected from their 27 families.  28 
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RA: My extended family doesnt get it and I dont try to make them.  Some of them havent even 30 kind of come to terms with the confederate flag so Im definitely not going to talk to them about 31 gender.   32 
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AJ: Got it. 34 
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RA: Its like  ah, no.   36 
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AJ: Yeah, youve got to move them on the flag and . . .  38 
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RA: Right. 40 
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AJ: Then you can get to the gender piece.  Wow.  To the extent that you are comfortable, have you 42 pursued any sort of medical intervention as a part of your identity? 43 
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RA: I havent.  I tried t but . . .  45 
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AJ: And when you say t what is that? 1 
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RA: Testosterone, but I dont think Ill ever do any kind of medical intervention because I have a 3 chronic progressive degenerative disease and its really hard for my body to heal.  So thinking 4 about doing medical intervention in the line of surgery seems not a reality for me.   5 
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AJ: OK, thank you for even approaching that question.  Its a really sensitive question.   7 
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RA: It is. 9 
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AJ: And so I appreciate your honesty around that and willingness.  So, I know that like many of us on 11 this journey, you have tried to conform to gender norms at some point in your life, but since 12 youve made that shift and decided to express your truer gender identity, what are some of the 13 pivotal moments that have defined your new life or this life?  And is there anything you would 14 do differently? 15 
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RA: Well I think there are definitely some defining moments.  I think one of the biggest ones was 17 probably with somebody that I was engaged with romantically who said . . . it was probably one 18 of the first times I really said, Oh, I can actually do something about my gender, and she said, 19 Youre almost perfect, if you were only a dude then I could take you home and meet my 20 parents.  And so then I was like, Oh, thats super harsh  Im pretty guy-like.  And so I think 21 that was a kind of defining moment where I said, Oh, people do see me as this masculine 22 person, but I have an issue  I have a glitch.  So I think that was one.  I think some other 23 defining moments have happened from people that actually really care about me and so I think 24 one of those defining moments was when Billy Navarro said to me, Youre not a she, youre a 25 they.  And I said, Oh, let me think about that.  And then I think my current partner gives me 26 lots of space, sometimes Anna has been called the trans whisperer.  Many of her partners have 27 transitioned during their relationship and I think that thats because she provides a really safe 28 place for people to be all that they are.  I think that thats really important to lots of folks kind of 29 on this gender journey.   30 
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AJ: Wow.  So you led right into some of my next thoughts.  Its around romance and relationships 32 and love and how that has been impacted by your gender identity.  And I know you just talked 33 about some of those key moments and pivotal moments including your current relationship 34 with Anna, but can you talk a little bit more about what have been some of the challenges in 35 dating as it relates to your gender identity?   36 
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RA: Well I think one of those is just that we humans all have kind of preconceived notions of how 38 things should be and then we get those notions kind of validated by what societys standards 39 are.  I think one of the things that has been really difficult for me is presentation.  So people see 40 me or they hear me talk or they might hear a phrase I say and they associate maleness with that 41 and then think that I should do something different with my body presentation.  So I remember 42 one person that I went out on a date with and we were talking and I had on an A shirt and she 43 said to me something about, Why are you showing your cleavage?  Why do you do that?  And 44 it was a hot day, it was fairly comfortable.  And so that kind of expectation about how people 45 
fulfill gender roles and what that should look like, I think those are some of the hardest things 1 because Ive never conformed to gender.   2 
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AJ: Right, in either . . .  4 
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RA: In either kind of way.  So I think that that has been the most difficult thing is really pushing up 6 against what those expectations are that other people have.   7 
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AJ: Im just trying to get a real clear understanding.  So people sort of read your gender identity as 9 masculine now and anything that steps outside of that boundary, you sort of get checked on.   10 
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RA: Right. 12 
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AJ: Interesting.  Wow.  Whats the relationship between the L, the G, the B, and sort of the trans 14 and gender nonconforming community in your mind? 15 
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RA: Really separate.  I think that the Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual community got lumped together with 17 trans folks and Im guessing that that happened kind of as a sense of security and safety, 18 probably more for trans people than the LGB people.  I think that our movement hasnt done a 19 good job of understanding or being inclusive of trans people or people of color.  I think that . . .  20 
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AJ: Our movement . . . the . . .? 22 
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RA: Our movement  the larger LGBT community.  I dont think that the T goes with the G and the L 24 and the B.  Gender is a very different concept than who you want to hold hands with and I think 25 that its often why many people in the trans community get the assumption put on them that 26 they are not being real.  So why does a trans feminine woman want to date another feminine 27 woman?  Whats wrong with that? But I think in our community people question that and move 28 really quickly back to kind of the binary and so the assumption is that I should be with a 29 feminine woman and Im guessing you get the assumption that you should be with a masculine 30 person.   31 
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AJ: I do.   33 
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RA: And so I think that really you were probably one of the first people who checked me on that and 35 I think that the stuff that Ive learned from that is really about these gender roles that society 36 puts on people are really different than sexual orientation or sexual identity roles that people 37 put on.  So I really think that our community hasnt done a really good job of connecting the gay 38 and lesbian people to bisexual and trans folks.  And I think the B and the T get pushed to the 39 side and I dont think that we have very much connectivity.  I think that some of that is changing 40 a little bit and I hope that as the movement kind of roles over the new wave that we become 41 better at figuring out how to be respectful and inclusive of trans folks.   42 
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AJ: Wow.  What do you think the agenda should be for the trans community now that sort of same 44 sex marriage is the law of the land and everybody has equal rights as it relates to marriage?  Is 45 there a trans agenda?  Should there be a trans agenda? 46 
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RA: I think there is, I think there should be a trans agenda and I think that our agenda is about 2 fairness and equity.  I dont know, somebody said, brilliantly, Some of yall can get married 3 now, but trans people still dont have any rights.   4 
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AJ: Who said that? 6 
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RA: I dont know, I think it was Andrea Jenkins.   8 
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AJ: Oh, OK.   10 
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RA: You know, so yeah  trans people can get married now, but can we afford to get married?  Do 12 we get paid the same amount as straight folks or our cis, queer brothers and sisters?  No, we 13 dont.  And can we access housing in the same way?  No we cant.  And so I think that, you know, 14 the realness is about equality and equity and I think that that equity is about employment and 15 housing and making sure that trans folks arent discriminated in those two areas.   16 
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AJ: Yeah . . . no, thats critical.  Access to health care.  Has there been any negative interactions for 18 you within the medical system or the criminal justice system or in any educational institutions?   19 
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RA: Sure, in the criminal justice system I have been mistaken for a Black man and that resulted in 21 what I would call a physical assault where I got slammed up against a skyway by a Hennepin 22 County security person because I fit the description of somebody that they were looking for and 23 that description was a Black man with dreads.  And so I think that yeah, the criminal justice 24 system Ive definitely kind of . . . impact, and most of the time those things havent been super 25 fun or nice to experience because its about the assumption of being a Black male and then that 26 means that Im in danger.  With employment, because Ive been professionally queer for quite a 27 long time, that helps with the employment.  But once I step outside of the queer community, 28 then there is weirdness that gets assigned and so the last job that I had outside of being gay for 29 pay, was . . . there was a lot of expectation and weird expectation  the office was filled with 30 mostly women, so I didnt fit in very good there and then it was mostly straight people and we 31 would sit around the break room and they would talk about their husbands and if I said 32 something about my partner, then everybody was uncomfortable.  And so I think that there is 33 definitely that discrimination too.  Ive been kind of lucky that Ive skated kind of on the inside of 34 that ring.   35 
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AJ: Wow.  You talked about gay for pay.  And I know you worked at District 202, what are some of 37 the other LGBT organizations that you either founded, worked with, volunteered at? 38 
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RA: So the first one was Minnesota Men of Color, and I worked there for several years with 40 phenomenal people like Nick Metcalf and Brandon Lacy Campos, just phenomenal, phenomenal 41 people.  And then I went to District 202 and what was the next gay for pay job I had?  I dont 42 know.  When I left District 202, I went to work for Allina and I was a medic for a minute there, 43 then I did a mental health job and I worked there for a minute.  And then . . .  44 
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AJ: It seems to me I recall you started something called Black Pride or something like that? 46 
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RA: Yeah, I didnt really start Black Pride, my brother-in-law Dennis Anderson started Black Pride but 2 I was definitely his right-hand man.  Yeah, we did that for a long time.  I was the vice president.  I 3 worked for PFLAG and I was on their board for many years  and then I was their administrator 4 for a year or so.  And I helped found Rare Productions with Rochelle James, and thats an art and 5 entertainment production company.  So I did that for many years and we were able to do really 6 awesome things like start Soul Friday.  And then from there, lets see, I went to the Minnesota 7 Transgender Health Coalition and I volunteered there for a couple of years as a shot caller and 8 then I was the director there for several years.  And then from MTHC, I went to TYSN, the Trans 9 Youth Support Network, and my job there was to help young people have the skills they needed 10 to run the organization and they did that really well. 11 
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AJ: What did TYSN do?  Youre naming these organizations . . . many people who are going to view 13 this, they have no clue what these organizations are and they are amazing work that you guys 14 were doing and I just want to make sure that it gets its fair . . .  15 
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RA: TYSN was this awesome organization that was really founded . . . it was founded because of an 17 assault that happened, not just one but multiple. 18 
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AJ: But there was one that really . . . Tamika was shot. 20 
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RA: Yes, Tamika was shot and . . .  22 
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AJ: Five times in the face by a boyfriend. 24 
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RA: Right, and there was a face slashing . . . there were several events that happened against trans 26 women or effeminate men and that really sparked, I would say, well-meaning social worker, 27 case worker types, from different youth serving organizations, to come together and really talk 28 about what could they do and what should the community do as a response to this violence. 29 
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AJ: I remember Rocki Simones and Jendeen Forberg. 31 
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RA: People from Youthlink, Archdale, The Bridge, all these youth-serving organizations kind of came 33 together and had several discussions and what came from that is the formation of the Trans 34 Youth Support Network.  And TYSN existed for many years and they did awesome things like . . . 35 
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AJ: The first director was Ryan Lee? 37 
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RA: No, Ryan Lee wasnt the first director . . . I cant remember who the first director was now.  Ryan 39 Lee was the second director and really kind of moved the organization into a youth powered, 40 youth centric kind of model.  And then Ryan Lee got an opportunity to move and then Katie 41 Burgess became the next director.  Katie accelerated that youth empowerment and created a 42 youth leadership model and really helped young people find their voice.  Some people might 43 look at TYSN in the community and say, Oh, well, TYSN closed so therefore its a failure.  But 44 what really happened with TYSN is young people became empowered and made the decision 45 that TYSN was no longer useful for them.  And I think that . . .  46 
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AJ: And it lasted for 10 years. 2 
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RA: It lasted for 10 years.  I think that thats an extreme example of the ultimate empowerment.  4 Often times we say in social service agencies that our goal is to make ourselves not have a job.  5 Right? And the young people of TYSN actually really did that.   6 
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AJ: They did that. 8 
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RA: They were able to look at their organization and really . . . and they tried to re-shape the mission 10 to see if that would give kind of a better fit to what they wanted to do and then decided 11 actually, We dont need this entity anymore, this entity was not created by us, it was created 12 for us and we want to have the opportunity to create our own opportunities.  And so some of 13 those young people from TYSN are now doing their own speaking gigs.  Theyve begun working 14 on their own LLC where they are going to be doing lectures and workshops all over the country.  15 Some of them just funded their own trip to the Allied Media Conference where they went and 16 presented and learned.  And so I think that what they did was a powerful act of courage.  And I 17 hope that in time people will look at that and be like, Wow, those youth were radical and 18 awesome.   19 
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AJ: Yeah.  No, I personally will say that right now today.  Those youth were radical and awesome.  21 Absolutely. 22 
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RA: Yeah, they were  and they still are, yes, totally.   24 
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AJ: And they still are.  So, youve been involved in so many trans and LGBT centered organizations 26 and work for such a long period of time, Roxanne.  How does it feel to be sort of . . . and I think I 27 am being probably a little bit . . . Im trying to find the word, but how does it feel to be an icon in 28 our community?  29 
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RA: An icon?  Oh my God, speaking of icon . . . Im sitting across from an icon.  I dont know, it feels 31 weird, I guess, when people put that word . . . I dont think of myself that way.  I think of myself 32 as somebody who knows that there is a lot of work to be done and Im willing to kind of get my 33 hands dirty to do that.  I also recognize that I have a lot of privilege - I have a house, I have a car, 34 I have a job, I have family members who will support me and help me if I need it.  So, I think, 35 with that privilege comes expectation and that expectation is from my own self which says, You 36 have the ability to access places that other people dont  and you have a voice and not 37 everybody can use their voice.  And so I think that thats the thing that kind of pushes me and 38 so I think of myself more as a bridging mechanism than an icon.  I feel like my role is really to 39 support other people in finding their own power and to encourage them to stand up when they 40 can and help support them when they need that.  That doesnt feel very iconic to me.   41 
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AJ: Well, it wouldnt be iconic if we had many, many more people doing those kinds of things. 43 
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RA: True. 45 
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AJ: But the fact that not very many people step up to those levels of responsibility and like you said, 1 you have this privilege but with privilege comes responsibility and just so many people are off 2 on their own thing and rightly so, if you thats how you want to proceed in your life  certainly, 3 but theres not a lot of people who give to the extent that you give, Roxanne.   4 
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RA: Thank you. 6 
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AJ: And Im grateful for it and I know that . . . and particularly you work with a lot of young people 8 and youre just creating these models and these opportunities for people, like you said, to come 9 into their own power and understand their own significance in this movement and in this 10 struggle. 11 
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RA: Now if I could just find that I would be happy.   13 
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AJ: Yeah, I know youre working on that  so thats awesome.  What do you feel like the impact of 15 your gender nonconforming identity has had on your professional life? 16 
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RA: Well . . .  18 
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AJ: Because you said youve had a lot of jobs in the gay world.  20 
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RA: I think that its kind of two part, right?  So one part of that makes it really easy to tokenize or use 22 or put on display and so thats happened a lot and it happens on a daily basis and its something 23 that I encounter, and lots of people that do this work encounter.  I think that thats probably the 24 hardest thing, to really move beyond that tokenism and trying to kind of go underneath 25 whatever that mechanism is and sometimes its super frustrating, especially when youre at the 26 intersectionality of trans identity and brownness and poverty to really feel like that impact is 27 happening.  But I think that whats happened is by me trying my best to live my authentic self it 28 provides a pathway for other people, they dont have to work so hard if somebody has already 29 kind of trampled down the trail you dont have to work so hard to get to the other side.  And so I 30 think that thats kind of what it is  that Ive had really great mentors and really great people 31 who have come before me that Ive been able to follow.  And youre one of those people and so 32 . . . 33 
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AJ: Oh wow, thank you.   35 
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RA: And so I think that Ive also been really fortunate to have people hold doors open for me and to 37 encourage me and to invite me inside.  I think that thats one of the things that I really try to 38 make sure that I do is hold the door open for others and make sure that Im inviting other 39 people to come in like Ive been invited.   40 
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AJ: Wow, thats so amazing and just so special, Roxanne.  Im glad to be able to call you a friend and 42 a colleague and to be doing this work together with you.  I know that you have received a 43 number of awards in your long illustrious, sort of, journey in this work.  Right now, at this 44 moment in history, we kind of see a lot of attention being paid to transgender people, 45 transgender women in particular.   You know, Caitlin Jenner just came out a couple months ago, 46 and Laverne Cox has been a star of a television series, the first trans woman of color ever to be a 1 star of a TV series, and Transparent, the TV show, is winning all of these awards and things, and 2 so the transgender issues are really starting to get some significant awareness and significant 3 media and press.  I know, like you mentioned, that some of the violence that happens to trans 4 people, in particular trans women of color as you noted earlier, is still happening.   5 
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RA: In fact its kind of escalating in some places.   7 
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AJ: Yeah.  Im just hoping that you can talk about that a little bit and what are your feelings around 9 that? 10 
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RA: Well, I think my feelings around that is that it scares me.  I think that its great that Transparent 12 won awards, its awesome that Laverne Cox is a star and is a gracious star so she actually is a 13 real person.   14 
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AJ: And shes a strong advocate too.   16 
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RA: Shes a strong advocate  and those things are awesome.  I think that it doesnt really shine the 18 light on the experiences that the vast majority of trans people face  trans women of color 19 especially.  We can look at somebody like CeCe McDonald who literally her name was tagged all 20 over the world and yet CeCe still struggles every single day.   21 
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AJ: Right. 23 
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RA: To make sure that she has a place to stay and food to eat and that shes being respected when 25 she walks down the street.  And so, I think that while certain trans-ness is being featured, I dont 26 think that folks are still kind of really seeing the underbelly of what the vast majority of trans 27 women, especially trans women of color, face. 28 
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AJ: What are some of those issues, in your opinion? 30 
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RA: Well I think one of them is just the ability to walk down the street and be respected.  The 32 microaggressions that  one, that people of color face just in general, and then you add on a 33 layer of, Who is that?  What is that person?  Who is that walking on the street?  And then 34 thats another layer of microaggression and lets say you dont pass extremely well, then theres 35 another layer and then if you have . . . so theres so many layers to the trans womens existence 36 and no two are the same.  So I think that that kind of knowledge has to kind of get surfaced.   37 
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AJ: Right. 39 
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RA: And people check in and check out to TV and so we can see Laverne in her orange scrubs facing 41 the things that happen in jail and then the next day we see her on Melissa Harris-Perry being 42 fine and people kind of have the erasure then of the reality that lots and lots of trans women are 43 in jail and the other reality of that is lots of trans women are in jail not like Lavernes character  44 theyre in mens prisons facing excruciating daily episodes.   45 
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AJ: Right, yes.  Something that you eluded to earlier when we were talking about District 202 and 1 you said that it was at a time when sort of the onset of the internet and online presence and 2 social media, I dont even think Facebook was around back then, or at least not widely used.  But 3 now, in 2015, social media has exploded.  How do you see that playing a role in the trans 4 movement for equality and what role has it played up to this point? 5 
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RA: Well I think similarly to maybe the Black Lives Matter movement, more people are aware of it 7 because it gets put into their feed.  Whether they actually take action on that, I dont know.  But 8 I definitely think that social media has had the impact of people having a greater knowledge 9 base and so more people might be aware that trans people exist in the world, some people who 10 dig a little bit and click on to the next thing might have the awareness that there are some issues 11 in the trans and queer community but its often those people that you surface one or two pages 12 and you find out some things, but the real information comes from several clicks and most of us 13 arent willing to do several clicks. 14 
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AJ: Yeah, thats true. 16 
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RA: Myspace was kind of the thing that was out when I was at 202 and that had a pretty big social 18 connecter piece but how feeds work now is just a constant barrage of information.  People miss 19 a lot of stuff because unless youre actually looking at your feed all the time you miss things and 20 you dont know.   21 
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AJ: Thats a good point  absolutely.  So, where do you think . . . this is the perfect question for you, 23 Roxanne, where do you think the trans community . . . (a) do you think theres a trans 24 community; and, if so, where are we going to be 50 years from now? 25 
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RA: Wow.  Definitely, I think that there is a trans community.  I think that like some other 27 communities there are some different layers and sub cultures within trans community.  And so I 28 think that when we do a better job of connecting folks who cross dress to people who have a F 29 to M experience to the people who have an M to F experience and the people who are gender 30 nonconforming and we all kind of come together saying that we do gender differently, then I 31 think were still going to have those kind of like sub cultures, and thats OK.  Where I think and 32 hope that well be in 50 years is a non-issue.  I hope that in the next 50 years the binary kind of 33 goes away and people recognize that humans have many different layers to them.  I think that 34 what Ive seen in the last 15 years tells me that that is a possibility.  Fifteen years ago when I was 35 at District 202 and trans guys were starting to kind of emerge and come out, people were 36 freaked out about it, people were scared that these young people were transitioning so early.  37 And now its pretty well accepted that people who are gender variant start expressing that or 38 identifying that when theyre four or five and six.  Then people were like, Oh my God, we just 39 know about trans women, or, Oh my God, we just know about drag queens.  Right?  And so 40 in that 15 years, that trajectory thats happened is like, Oh, well now we recognize that there is 41 trans community and that that trans community has many different levels and theres all 42 different kinds of people in trans community.  And so hopefully in the next 50 years it wont be 43 a thing and that the binary will be more erased in our consciousness. 44 
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AJ: Wow.  This has been really fascinating, Roxanne.  Im learning some things having this 1 conversation with you.  Before we wrap up, is there anything else that you feel like is really 2 important or that you want to share about this particular topic. 3 
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RA: I cant think of anything.  One Love.   5 
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AJ: One love.  Thank you, Roxanne Anderson. 7 
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RA: Thank you, Andrea Jenkins. 9 

